When I first met the Amish, I spent a warm fuzzy period admiring and even idealizing Amish society. This was in the summer of 2004, and I was selling a set of books called the Family Bible Library to Amish families. I had spent a fruitful few weeks in the Arthur, Illinois community before traveling to Indiana.
I remember one day in the Daviess County, Indiana Amish settlement thinking to myself, wow, wouldn’t it be neat to be a part of this culture. I even remember who I’d been speaking to at the time.
It was a particularly sunny young farmer (late-20s, with some small kids) on the western side of the settlement. For some reason the topic of joining the Amish had come up. We’d been discussing another member of his community–let’s call him Mike.
Mike was unlike most Amishmen–he had actually joined the church from the outside, marrying an Amish girl and starting a family and a small home business. ”He’s doing okay so far!” the born-and-bred Amishman told me, striking a note of hope and optimism about the convert’s chances of making it.
I had actually previously met Mike, and though I didn’t think to ask him much about his experience at the time, he provided a concrete example of someone who had actually done it. What if..?
However, the allure of joining the Amish quickly wore off, as I describe in this piece about romanticizing the Amish. I came to see the Amish as similar to us (i.e., human), learned to appreciate the positive aspects of Amish life, and recognized that for various reasons there was no way I’d ever cut it in a pair of broadfall trousers.
I think everyone who comes to know the Amish on some level has the thought at least cross their mind, though.
It’s not for nothing that the all-time most-commented post on this blog is “So you want to join the Amish“. I can understand a lot of the sentiment expressed in the comments of that post, even if I think a lot of people are approaching the idea without fully thinking through the implications.
But for a few, I think joining the Amish is a dead-end road. Well, maybe not a dead-end road–that’s too negative. I’m sure that people that fail to be Amish take something important away from their experiences.
In any case, there are numerous examples of people who have tried to join but failed, either deciding against baptism or leaving some time after becoming a church member.
The sacrifices are great, and Amish themselves say that it is really hard to do unless you have been raised in the culture. On this point, I found Lance’s comments on “So you want to join the Amish” interesting:
When I tried to go Amish, I made the decision that it was pointless to long after things the Amish did not allow. I could not have them and that was that. So it was not a difficult burden to leave them behind. It took as long as it took to drive somewhere and there was no point to getting upset that a car could go faster. I never even thought of phone, TV, radio or computer.
I did miss running water for a shower, and, in hot weather, no fan to move the air made nights much more miserable.
What was problematic was the language barrier and the illogical/irrational rules. You must learn the language or you will just be left out at times. English speakers do not adapt easily to Germanic languages and you really need to learn both PA Deitsch and High German to understand at all times. It is not easy and some Amish do not learn the High German well.
Amish make changes to their rules by consensus of the church and if you were not there at the time the rule was made, it can be very hard to understand those rules. Without being born Amish and living in the system since young, you have a hard time adapting to, believing in and trusting it. It is the trust in the system or lack thereof that makes being Amish easy or hard. Our modern school systems teach critical thinking and that goes against Amish thought. They value a high level of yielding to the church in all things the church makes a stand. We have not been taught that and it is not easy to develop.
Though people’s experiences vary, I think Lance’s frank comments reflect a lot of the challenges of becoming Amish.
Yet even with the unlikelihood that that will ever happen, I still occasionally catch myself thinking what it would be like to live as an Amish person.
The well-known positive sides of Amish culture–a strong faith community, an arguably simpler lifestyle, family focus–have timeless appeal. When you’re stuck in traffic, breathing polluted air, anonymous in a big city, Amish grass can start to look pretty green.
I’m curious if you’ve ever pondered it too.
And so I’m wondering–if you “left the English”, why would you do it–and what is the greatest thing you think you’d gain?
Photo credit: whatatravisty
73 responses to If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Jitka,
Probably because we (as men) are expected to repair said technology and can’t stand something that is too complicated for us to easily repair?
I actually prefer the older manual methods over the more modern “labor saving” ones. Saw an interesting study a while back that the time saved by a variety of labor saving devices is paid for by having to work that time. I guess you either have time or money…
Aaron
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Food for thought...
Like so may others, I think the allure of joining an Amsih community mostly centers around a slower, simpler, less crazy pace of life. Family and community would be a great blessing, as would the new perspective on God and a deeper relationship with Him. I’m not sure they would accept me, however, as I am a veteran and have a handful of tattoos.
Romancing the Amish
You have a wonderful blog, and great book. I hope you write another book one. Maybe a practical comparison contrasts of Amish and English life.
To answer your question, we would gain the joys & struggles of a Godly life on the path of humility & yielding. Your friend Dr Kraybill covers it well in many writings; “Gelassenheit”; yielding fully to God’s will, with a dedicated heat, forsaking selfishness. It WILL be much harder for English because we are usually raised the opposite; training the individual for self fulfillment and individual success.
What I don’t understand is many leave because of an Amish lack of spirituality. Apparently the individuality of a growing a deep spiritual life creates conflicts. What is interesting is Amish culture & governance is built and maintained on the Bible.
In my honest opinion, peace <
Dave
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Dave thank you, and I hope to be able to write a few more yet
On spirituality, an interesting point, which may rest on what “spirituality” really means. I think there is a certain popular conception of spirituality but which may not be the only way to look at it. I also am not sure that being Amish would preclude individualism; in fact I have friends who would argue the opposite.
Appreciate you sharing here.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Amish religion
“I also am not sure that being Amish would preclude individualism; in fact I have friends who would argue the opposite.”
Erik,
Thank you for creating such an interesting blog. I wanted to respond to this thread regarding joining the Amish and the accompanying concern that there is a lack of spirituality in their faith practice. ALthough, most of my experience is with Old Order Mennonites, I think there is a similarity in their faith practices with those of the Amish. Members of the church are encouraged to reflect on their personal walk with Christ, but it is always in submission to the church community. I think what has most evangelical Christians confused is that they, the evangelicals, are used to the kind of pietistic and overtly evangelicaland proselytizing practices that were instituted in the Protestant church of the 19th century. These included methods that were never embraced by the Amish or O.O. Mennonites like the Sunday School movement or the wednesday night Bible study. Evangelicals assume that all believers, particularly those who like the Amish or O.O. Mennonites have biblical proscriptions for daily living, welcome these facets of Christian practice and are taken aback when they realize that they are not. For example, the first time I attended an Old Order Mennonite service in Lancaster County, PA, I had my Bible with me as I am wont to carry to church every Sunday to read and to make notes. My Mennonite friend, Erma, informed me that they did not ever bring Bibles to church and certainly never took notes, although she did say that there were some conservative Mennonite churches who did just that. It is interesting to note that my reaction to this initial visit was that the service, despite the overtly plain interior and egalatarian aspects of minister placement, had more the feeling of a liturgical Anglican service than it did a contemporary Baptist one. I thought a lot about this and came to the conclusion that the O.O. Mennonite service was unchanged since the 16th century and that the chanting of hymns and the use of the Gesangbuch was more akin to the ancient liturgical mass than it was the more individual and expository preaching services of the evangelical churches.After all, German is the language of the service as was Latin the preferred language of the liturgy. It is as if the plain church here in America skipped all the inroads of evangelical and pietist movements that the centuries of industrialization made in the Christian churches. Anyhow,I felt that the Christian walk was not something discussed or studied among members of the O.O. Mennonite church rather it was a path already laid out for them in the ordnung of the church. Because they are committed to the Church and truly believe that it is the bride of Christ, there is no hesitation or questioning the ways of it. That is why leaving the church or deviating away from it are such serious matters.
Great topic!
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Nice post Susan, very true. In answer to the critics who raise the points you listed, I would like to give more flippant answers in addition to what you gave, if I may. Thank you.
The strangest thing about the non-Plain churches is how they actually believe that they have a right to an opinion about scripture, about how they should follow it. It’s simple, God gave His opinion, we obey and follow, we do not have Bible studies in order to find out if we can find a better way of fulfilling scripture according to our opinion and in opposition to God’s opinion.
Ours not to question why, ours not to wonder why, ours just to do or die. Simple enough, thats what submission to the yoke of heaven as servants of the Most High King is all about. Obedience to the written Word as is, not how we believe it should have been written if we were to have writ it.
As to taking a Bible to Sunday service. We trust that the preacher is able to read scripture from his Bible without making a mistake. As to writing notes, we already have the Bible, we are forbidden to add to it, so what is there to write down? If hearing the live preaching is unable to move ones soul to repentance, writing it down certainly won’t help. Not so.
The Amish who leave the community on account of having found a personal Jesus, lie. It’s just a cover up to justify to themselves a more worldly technologically advanced lifestyle. Having a personal faith in Jesus does not exclude one from being separated from worldly technology, which seems to be what they think it means. Why can’t they just be honest and say “I can’t live this primitive technological lifestyle anymore” instead of hiding behind religion to justify their leaving.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Susan, I did not consider the impact of 18th & 19th Century piest and evalgelical movements. Your point on German to O.O. as Latin to Catholic is right on the mark.
Even though I am not living among the Amish, I believe that their way of life is the only way I can live. I am so much like them, it almost seems like I grew up with the Amish. I went to a public school after the second grade. No one understood me or was my friend. I didn’t laugh at their jokes, I didn’t speak like they did, I didn’t talk about people behind their backs, I didn’t want to dress like they did, I helped those who everyone else ignored, and I was always respectful to my parents and teachers. So I just focused on becoming smarter and smarter. Until I was a freshman in college. In highschool I had been at the top of my class. My parents had encouraged me to go to college. I didn’t think there was anything else to do with my life. The only good thing I saw in myself was intelligence. I had grown up around Asian culture. The influence of international students that had come to America to study PhDs in engineering had great influence on me. I wanted to be smart like them. The thought of being a mother and having a family was put out of my mind, as I couldn’t understand how to put a family and a modern job together. But shortly before I went to college, I became a fervent follower of Jesus. I knew that I had to give up my pride and love for knowledge, and look to Jesus to help me choose His will. Conflicted between the will of my parents and the will of God, I couldn’t share my heart with anyone out of fear of the conflict that would come and already existed in my family. I had grown up around many different cultures and ways of thinking. Being exposed to that made some in my family confused and they drifted towards hindu beliefs. I think that if we children would have only been protected from these other cultures, my family would not have been torn to shreds. The land mine that my family went through sent me reeling with a wound that I don’t think will ever heal. I had been raised in a traditional Christian home. Much of my family’s beliefs are shared by the Amish. But one thing isn’t: our desire to see the nations see the love of God in Jesus. That is one main reason why I went to public school. My dad is a farmer. We could have stayed with him and learned how to harvest hay and care for animals. But he valued our modern education more than he did value us learning skills of a farmer. Throughout my school years I would hear my dad warn us about the things the teachers would be saying, that we had to learn to distinguish the truth from lies. I took him very seriously. I wanted to know the truth. Because I am gifted with articulating the sounds and grammar of foreign languages, I decided that a foreign missionary could be the only way that I could do what the Lord wanted. So when I went to college I studied Spanish. I dropped out after one semester from not knowing how to obey the Lord and didn’t tell anybody for a year. I didn’t know what to do. Really scared, I decided I would try it again. I then began to study nursing. It was a little while after that I understood, from the opposition I had experienced my whole life from Western women,from reading the Bible, and from my church, that I was meant to be a mother. Western women are opposed to the concept that women are a treasure because of one main reason: for being a wife and a mother. Though Muslim women like to say that they value being a wife/mother, they really do envy the lives of Western women. About 7 months ago, I realized the onset of a much worser version of feminism was coming to America and the world. I knew that I wanted to get as far away as possible from it. Because I read the scripture on the head covering for women, I thought about wearing the Muslim abaya and hijab. I thought about becoming a nun. I wanted to quit school and go home to my parents, but they wouldn’t allow me to. I thought about becoming a seamstress and starting a school to teach the homeless to sew, cook, midwife, grow their own food, raise their own animals, build houses, and do all the things that American people had chosen to leave behind and have poorer countries do for them. I wanted to give the homeless a new way of life. I saw that Christian families were being made defective as a witness for Jesus because of modern jobs and the influence of strangers and other cultures on their children. Reading “A Chance to Die” about Amy Carmichael helped me to see that I could not have a family that would be effective as a bearer of light for the nations, if I couldn’t protect my children from the world’s influences- I want them to grow up knowing about only one culture. When they are old enough then they can decide whether or not to believe something else. I have a disdain for American culture in general. Perhaps it is the Asian influence on me, but I have a high value for family, for clean, joyful celebration, am very careful with my words, conscientious, able to laugh easily at simple, clean humor, disdain laziness/sloppiness/short cuts, and have a high value for politeness, quietness, and kindness. I have come to the conclusion that technology destroys culture, home-based skills for knitting the family together, and ultimately the home itself. Maybe what is going to happen is a global culture of technology. There will be no more separate families, trades, or cultures. Everybody will know one culture. Maybe there will be separate trades of technology. People might say, “I live on XYZ300″, indicating a type of technology that they live on. They will grow up with the idea that a type of technology is where they live.
So, “if I left the English, what would I lose?” The only thing is the memory of my family as it was before it was destroyed. And I won’t really lose that because it is a memory. I have already lost the cohesiveness of my family. I feel that there is nothing left. The way of life I have now- pretending to enjoy and admire the beauty and pride of this world while I am in nursing school- it is absolutely worthless and futile to me…and to those generations who may follow me. If I would give anything to my children, it would be a love for the Lord Jesus. I can only do this by making sure that my hands are fruitful by working with my husband and children and so that our children can learn from us and work with us. This is the only way to be effective for Jesus as a family. In any other way and any family will fall apart. “If I left the English, what would I gain?” I would gain the support of people who are fervent to protect their children from the influences of the world, so that they might be rooted securely in the truth and love of Jesus. The Amish may not be “evangelistic” but their families are proof in itself of the life and testimony of the Lord Jesus that is waiting in heaven for His church. I have nothing but the Lord. All is laid waste. There is no one to redeem us but You, O Lord.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Catherine
It seems to me that you have been doing a lot of seeking your entire life and that you claim to be a follower of Jesus without really having any of the peace that accompanies that walk. Your comment indicates that you are jumping all over the place because you are looking for what you think for that moment is what you are being called to do and not seeing that God does not instigage such freneticism in His people. The Amish are a people who believe in being quiet and obedient and the means they do not assert their individual selves very much. Perhaps Catherine, you should join a biblically sound Church and find edification and strength with other believers.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Sharing in your pain
Catherine,
I was really touched by your comment. I can personally identify with some of the pain you share with family falling apart. It could even be, why I was originally drawn to the Amish so much even as a Born Again Christian. You sound like your sharing so many observations of so many needs in the culture we live. And the culture, has infected the church. I agree with Susan, a good sound church, Bible teaching, with women’s study would be good, yet they’re getting harder to find that haven’t been influenced by the confusing culture, slowly departing from the way of the Cross.
I believe you would find alot of peace in this message by Alister Begg, parts A & B (9/1/11 & 9/2/11)”The Biblical Role for Women”
Interestingly enough, this pastor points out we could draw alot from the Amish regarding women’s roles, in light of the book of Titus.
Also, there is a single woman, Nancy Leigh DeMoss who is so counter-cultural with regard’s to the direction for Christian women, I praise God for her radio ministry & books.
2 books to recommend to regain what the church has lost when we bought into the lies of the Women’s Lib Movement
1. Lies Women Believe 2. Lies Young Women Believe (for teens)
Her radio show, can be heard by www.reviveourhearts.com so just a note of encouragement, many Christian women are experiencing a time of trying to find our way back to God’s intentions for us.
Blessings to you.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
dis-heartened by the "world"
My primary physician is a Mennonite and i had the pleasure of staying with his family for a few days several years ago. I believe they are conservatives.
I reflect often on thier aversion to the culture of the world and in recent months have been spending a lot of time, due to illness, on the net looking at many things, and imparticular conspiracy theories.
It does appear as if there is a conspiracy that emanates through the catholic church all the way to hollywood that is, at the highest levels covertly and on the lowest reaches flagrantly, satanic.
I am not here to preach or enlighten, I wept for days over the catholic church and and still punch drunk from these realizations.
But in the past several days I did remember Doc saying to me “just remember if you get too beat up out there you can always come out here to be with us”
I never dreamed I would see something so pervasively evil in our culture that I would consider it, but I do now, I really do.
Knowledge of this conspiracy has changed my views on music, art and
entertainment…I have heard of this band or that band worshipping
satan, but the whole industry?? Check it , don’t take my word. For all you know I could be some paranoid conspiracy theorist! Which is exactly what I used to think when i heard someone rambling on about this stuff.
What i would gain is purity, A knowing that I was really striving toward holiness and among those who were not tainted, in any way, by this pollution.
I can’t believe I just said that. God certainly has done a work in me.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Vicki: Actually, you should pray for them, do without “Hollywood” in your life, if that is The Lord’s will, but pray for them, forgive them. Let yourself do what The Lord wills for you to do.
Just a thought.
thank you
WHY THANK YOU FOR THE KIND ADVICE. Praying for the deceived is a good idea in any case.
I do not feel it is my position to forgive or not forgive; in any event I feel sorry for the countless mis-led and grateful for the miracle of my salvation.
I am praying for our Lord to reveal his plans for my life after a long illness and I welcome your prayers for me also brother. thank you.
Please clarify your comments on Catholic church
Vicky: Can you clarify your ocmments on the conspiracy in the Catholic church? I, too, am catholic and have my own concerns over the church becoming far too liberal on many things. So, I’m interested in your clarification of the satanic influence within the Catholic church. Thanks!
here are some key words for you to research
Reformation, jesuits, illuminati, nwo, black pope, president central bank of europe (a jesuit), rothschild, rockefeller, bildenberg…all connected to each other. try searching i.e. jesuits and bildenberg or jesuits and illuminati etc. mix it up.
try to sort through fanatic haters and concerned observers of history.
further info
Brother rob,
found this today on youtube most holy family monastery.
I would start with a video called abortion, rock music and freemasonry. be prepared to take in a lot of info.
lmk what you think and what you find
A different "look" at why we seek amish values/Culture
I have read with interest and pleasure all of my fellow Christian friends here at this site and many other sites about the subject of becoming Amish,being Amish,Amish religion and beliefs. It occurs to me that it’s our human infalabilities of our sort of “on the fence” religious upbringings that has lead us here to these Amish pages and subjects. We are all looking for answers and on the other hand we still have questions. Its sounds weird but hear me out.
Most of us have been taught to lead a Christian life. Most of us have been taught as someone said earlier to achieve a “self-fulfilling role” in our modern Industrial nations. ALL of our churches have struggled with trying to use scripture to help with moderating the ever changing world we live in which by the way includes our greedy thoughts and pleasures. The Amish have seemed to define the answer we seek. Although we have found flaws in their beliefs, in genereral, I feel that they have been one of the few religions that have accomodated the values and work ethics that we want to live with. They have taken the “static” as it were out of the signal. For us we just can’t seem to sacrifice some ingredients in our “Bread of Life” in order to make a better loaf. We are weak and there in lies our struggle.
We are bombarded with commercials everywhere in books,magazines,T.V.,radio,etc. The pressure to buy our material goods to bring us pleasure is never ending. Look to our amish friends examples to show us what little we need in our lives to be happy-no big church : but a stronger following envied by millions. no big egos-no big sprots stars-no big anything. We must get over this buying to succeed/big churches/big everything ! Until we see ourselves as the Amish see them selves we will never move onto what they show us every day. The real way to live our lives-Faith,smallness of ones self and ego-God and Family and community above all else.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
Well said.
I don’t feel I would gain anything….I would lose a lot……not about to give up my car, and water in the house…..been there, done that…..now I want the easy things….why would I want to get up @ 4:am to start milking the cows…..or start my day using a gas powered washing machine and having to hang the wash outside….been there,done that….I feel I have earned the easy life now and I would want it no other way….I admire the Amish if that is what they want to do…..I don’t feel you have to make life hard for you to serve the Lord……I’ve had things hard growing up and appreciate what I have now,so I will admire the Amish and read about them and visit them, but never would I leave the English…..just sayin
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
If I left the Englisch, the main (possibly only) thing I would gain would be fitting in. Even just visiting Amish country for a couple of days, I felt easy acceptance by a lot of the Amish and Mennonites I spoke to (after the initial “Are you Mennonite? Are you Brethren? Are you sure you’re not Mennonite?” phase). I guess modest dresses and prayer coverings just don’t seem normal in Australia…
Apart from that, I don’t think there’s much I would gain from leaving the Englisch and joining the Amish that I couldn’t gain whilst remaining “Englisch”. A lot of their lifestyle, faith, and clothing can be a personal choice for anyone, Amish or not. The only difference is that they don’t consider it strange!
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
No individuality
One of the points about Amish living that no one seems to recognize is the fact that their lifestyle is one of very restrictive conformity, something nearly all of us would balk at. The hallmark of the Amish persepective is something called gelassenheit which means a letting go. You let go of your sense of “rugged individualism” in favor of suppressed ego that is secondary to the community. You just don’t “join the Amish” because so much of what it means to be Amish has to be instilled into you from birth including understanding German. There are no lone ranger Amish,that would be a contradiction of terms. The Amish are fascinating and their unadorned Christianity inspiring but despite your “back to nature” outlook, converts to their community almost never exist.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
People not born into the Amish culture — and many who are born into it — may nearly all view Amish culture as mind-numbingly conformist and dull, a culture full of submissive followers.
After all, nearly from birth, most English are raised with praise for being just the opposite; English culture ( in the US and for the most part ) values individuality, independence, excitement, leadership, and I believe, dominance. Express yourself! Be yourself! Don’t be a follower, be a leader! Leadership awards abound in public schools — do you really think there would be praise for wisdom for something like wise discipleship ( no religious connotation )? *grins*
The two cultures seem just about at odds as to what they value.
Just as there are quite a fair number of Amish people whose personalities, and wills, in the end will drive them from their communities and even families, it seems safe to say there would also be a fair number of those born English whose natures would seem to fit better with Amish principles.
It doesn’t seem to me that either culture is 100% either way, though. There are many opportunities for English people — who, had they been Amish-born, been likely to be quite content — to thrive while not being Amish. Though opportunities for those people inclined to express individuality among the Amish may be far fewer, I would truly not say there are none; they seem to me to be more inclined to be instances where expressing one’s special talents, ideas, and individuality will be valued more for the beneficial effect upon the whole — rather than on financial gain, fame, or pride. For example, a man among the Amish whose talents and inclinations lean toward teaching or leather working may be more likely to end up in an occupation like those, rather than making a living as a farmer. To most English, that may seem an exceedingly dull choice. But not to all — and I think that for a very small number of non-Amish who recognize the subtlety of such discrepancies, who can also not only tolerate, but find happiness and contentment within the multitude of incredibly foreign boundaries and expectations of Amish culture, then it’d not necessarily be impossible for one to leave the English — and thrive without giving up who they are, but finding their place there.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
To be Amish means that you are a German speaking, Christian whose beliefs are not evangelistic but proscribed from 16th century texts. You may have a talented craft and make money at it, but it is not to express yourself rather it is to earn money for your family. Your education is 8th grade because anything beyond that does not comply with the criteria of plain living . You are ever mindful of how you are perceived by others. It means your behavior and your family’s behavior is scrutinized by your neighbor. In the Amish world (not the Old Order Mennonite) you can still be shunned if you do something that the community prohibits. The Amish do not welcome converts because they know you just don’t convert to being Amish. It is not like living in a Hippie commune nor is it like living in a 19th century museum village. They do not churn their own butter or cook on a fireplace. They embrace modern technology rather passionately if it is allowed by the Bishops for earning money like cell phones or computers in the workplace. I have seen teens texting . So, although we can certainly learn from the Amish, I don’t see many “English” entering their lifestyles for very long.
If you “left the English”, what would you gain?
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